An interview with Col. Hla Min
MYANMAR INFORMATION COMMITTEE YANGON :Information Sheet No.C-2068 ( I/L ) 30th December, 2001
Special Feature
This office is presenting an interview with Col. Hla Min by Channel- J News Agency (Japan) on August, 2001 in Yangon which was telecasted in Japan on September, 2001.
Col. Hla Min (Government Spokesman) - Office of Strategic Studies, Ministry of Defence
Panel Interviewers: Prof. Takashi Shiraishi of Kyoto University and Nagaraharu Hayabusa, Journalist.
Continuation of 29 December, 2001
Q: Do you have any schedule for transition to the constitutional government?
A: Yes. I would not say a schedule. Because if you look at how the present National Convention is functioning, we had two previous constitutions in the past both of them were based on vote majority. In this country when we go for vote majority it is undemocratic.
Seventy percent will definitely win. Even if all the other ethnic groups combine, they are only thirty percent. So we don`t want history to repeat itself. We said this time it has to be based on consensus.
Consensus, of course, saying is easy but in reality it is quite difficult. This is a very challenging task which we learned in the process. Because as I earlier mentioned out of the eight major national races we have 135 different ethnic groups. All of them are involved in the National Convention in drafting this new constitution. A lot of them want to have their own autonomous states and realistically how can we split Myanmar into one hundred mini states?This is impossible. So we have to find ways and means to make these ethnic groups happy. Of course some will be happier, some will be less happy but at least we are trying to make everybody contented.
In this National Convention process we are now working on the most sensitive and critical chapter, which we call power sharing. Power sharing between the central government and the states and the division. So this is not a very easy task. Some of our friends have given us a friendly advice saying that why doesn`t the Government of Myanmar put a deadline so that the outside world will be convinced that the government is actually not dragging its feet but seriously going for the transformation.
We said that that is a very good advice and we had already thought about it. The problem we are facing is, when these groups - armed groups, made peace with the central government they did not all come at this same time. They came in differently, at different time, from different areas. If we were to take away the arms of the first group that made peace with us, than that group would be exposed and some other groups will come in.
And can the central government give them full protection?
No.Because we have very long borders, and the terrain is tough and it is very remote. So we cannot guarantee them hundred percent protection. That is why when they made peace we have an understanding which is that they may retain their arms in their designated area until the time we finish drafting our new constitution. So before the constitution finishes, we will not take away their arms.
Now we are working together in this drafting process, but if we put a deadline that means we have to push. Automatically, we would then have to change our system from consensus to vote majority. Because with consensus you cannot put a deadline. That`s impossible. Pushing deadline that means vote majority, and if we do that, those armed groups would say that the government now has changed its tune.
We don`t want this kind of misunderstanding to come between us or among us. Even though we accept this advice but it is impossible for us to do it. We have to work our own way, very patiently, very systematically, slowly, slowly, slowly, we will move forward, but were also facing some unnecessary problems.
What Myanmar needs during this time of transition while we are in the gray spot, we haven`t reached the white area yet, we left the black spot, the dark spot, we are now in the gray area. If we have some kind of push from the behind, which means assistance, support and understanding from the international community, we will reach our objective in a shorter period of time. Because the objective is the same, we have the common objective. They want Myanmar to be a democracy and we also want Myanmar to be a functioning democracy, so it`s almost the same.
Instead of having the push from the back what we are facing is were getting the kick from the front all the time And we are hit left and right almost every day. So as a Third World country we are also very much concerned that we may get derailed. In that kind of scenario, if I use a military term, I would say that the government will just dig in and wait until the coast clears, and the coast doesn`t seem to be clear now.
The government has a very tough time trying to move forward. What we are asking for is assistance, support, understanding, and of course we would like to share the experience of those countries that are fortunate enough to reach the same objective without having a civil war or facing anarchism and chaos.
Q: Did joining ASEAN help you? Does it play a reconciliatory role?
A: Definitely yes. Because you see, in the past Myanmar was a socialist country and we were quite secluded, even if we were not isolated, we were quite secluded. But after 1988 the new government tried to open all the doors from inside. Unfortunately some of the doors from the outside were shut again.
For Myanmar, we would like to interact, cooperate with the international community so that we can have better knowledge, technical know how, and we can share our natural resources so that it can benefit both parties. It`s not that we will always be on the receiving end. There are many ways that we can also help. In this way we gradually want to open up Myanmar so that we can also be in the main stream. So there was our vision. Being able to join ASEAN helped us in many ways because we are also attending a lot of meetings held in various ASEAN countries, exchanging views and knowledge.
We get very good advise from our friends there, for which we are very grateful. This is very helpful for a country like Myanmar in our present situation. Unfortunately because of the 97 financial crisis we were not able to help each other as much as we want to, but were quite optimistic that sometimes in the near future when all our economies will be, sort of back to normal again, then we will be able to help each other out. Because Myanmar` s vision is similar to the ASEAN vision.
We want South East Asia to become the economic power in this century. We have the natural resources, we have the manpower, we have all what is required. The only thing is that we need to really work together to achieve our common objective.
Q: From China`s prospective, access to South East Asia has been a dream as is access through Burma to the Indian Ocean. China`s Western provinces, and Hong Kong, are too far. So how do the Burmese view that? Are they welcoming commercial access for China to the Indian Ocean?
A: For Myanmar, if this kind of project benefits both nations we have nothing against it, because we also understand that China is a big market. By providing some sort of help to China at the same time it will also be helpful for Myanmar. So we will look at it from a very objective point of view.
Q: I have to share my experience. Our relations with Thailand and China are very warm very close and we benefit greatly, greatly. We are closest friends.
A: Yes, we are always following the development in the region, and that is why I say that we have been learning from the activities of our friends and colleagues in the region. What is compatible to Myanmar situation we always adapt, and sometimes it is not compatible, so we cannot adapt. We understand each other and that is why we are able to work together. But sometimes some of the countries in the western world, they always think that their values and their methods are workable everywhere and if that certain country does not follow that advice then certain penalties are imposed on it. So I think this is very regretful.
Q: Do you also get military assistance from China?
A: Not as assistance in grants, but we do buy certain equipment from China.
Q: This was concession loans?
A: Well I would say if we are given discounts, big discounts and if the price is right we will be very happy to buy.
Q: Slightly different question but how do you envision the role of the military in the political system in the future? Do you expect the military to remain as a part of the political system? For example, representation in the Parliament, seconding offices for civilian positions and being involved in the policy making on an everyday basis, not only on defense and security matters but other matters, too.
A: I cannot give you a very complete answer at this stage because this is still under discussion at the National Convention. But generally speaking I would say that, yes, we will also be involved in the future political process of the country because we will be having twenty five percent of the seats in the Parliament. That means we will be represented officially in Parliament. The definite task to be given to the armed forces I think will be decided later.
Q: May I respond to you? Thailand changed from constitutional absolute monarchy to constitutional monarchy in 32 and from then on it was military dominant - until 40, 50, 60, and 70. It took place gradually - the military is now completely out - it took about 70 years.
Q: The political system under which the 25 percent of the whole members of the two houses will be assigned to the military - it is rather like the political system under Suharto of Indonesia.
A: I believe that in the initial part - in the beginning part, 25 percent is there but gradually when the country has more experience and is enjoying peace and stability I believe that the number will slowly reduce until the time when we fade out. But this cannot become overnight. It`ll take time. It will evolve. And this is what the Myanmar people want. We want evolution. We don`t want revolution. We are learning from many other countries.
Q: I understand that the constitution is still being debated and therefore there is no final shape there. So it`s probably unjust asking you a sort of temporary provisional opinion, but given your explanation that 25 percent are for the military, that means 75 percent are for political parties. Will NLD he allowed to be a part of this competition for seats?
A: You see the NLD is a legal political party. They were part of the process in the beginning but unfortunately they choose to walk out. I think after two years, or something, but still they are a legal political party. So I would say that we cannot count them out.
Q: I see, so they will be most likely allowed to compete in the competition in the elections in the future.
A: I cannot give you black and white answer at this date because when you walk out you are disqualified after certain number of days if you don`t come back in. The National Convention will automatically disqualify that party. But I think this is for the decision maker to decide what they will do in the near future. So that`s why I cannot give you black and white answer now.
Q: I understand that there is a complicated political situation in this country but I don`t think it is natural that the tentative government continues, it has been taking a long time to establish a new constitution. What do you think of this?
A: That is a very good question because that was answered by our head of state a few years back when he was being interviewed by an American news magazine. He said that if Myanmar`s political situation was not interfered by the outside countries and if we are given the chance to resolve our own domestic politics, he said the constitution could be over in three years time. That the new government will come into power.
Q: I see, three years.
A: If, it`s a big if That is still not materializing.
Q: Regarding the relationship between your county and China. Has the Chinese government requested Myanmar to lease the ports on the Coco Island?
A: No, because Myanmar`s foreign policy is, since day one, we are everybody` s friends; we are nobody`s ally. So we will not let any outside power have a military base on our soil, because we don`t want our soil to be used against any of our neighbors. We are still following this strict neutrality.
It is a terrible rumor but it`s a rumor. I have always challenge a lot of my friends who asked me the same question. Coco Island is the small island. It`s an open island. In today`s world with the satellites and the spy planes you can even read the number on the golf ball there. So why is this thing becoming a very big issue in the region.
Of course there are reasons. I see there are two reasons for creating this kind of rumor. One reason I will not give to you now, but I can give you the second reason.Most of the countries that are selling arms to the Third World countries they have all this information. It is very easy for them to check whether the Coco is being used by the Chinese or not, but they are keeping very quiet.
Before the financial crisis hit South East Asia a lot of these countries - they can spend a lot of money - so when this threat came into existence many of our friends in South East Asia were buying, unnecessarily buying a lot of military equipment which those countries were selling. We have told our colleagues don`t buy it. Don`t waste your money. We will never let it happen. Use your money wisely elsewhere. We have told them many times on many occasions.
Q: The last question: Will you tell me your personal opinion. What is the prospect for the political situation in the future in Myanmar?
A: The political situation I see is very encouraging today. I will say that because I`m always an optimist. Let me give you the comparison so you can see the picture very vividly. I will take you one year back. At that time the domestic political situation in the country was quite bleak, because the government and the NLD, the political party, were more or less at the confrontational level.
Today even if we cannot say it is very good, it is quite good. So if we continue to walk along this path, next year by this time it could be good or very good.
I think I believe we are going in the right direction. But dialog is always two ways. The government is trying to show positive gestures not only to the political party but also for the international community to see.
I think the international community also has to reciprocate in a similar way. Instead of just looking the other way and keep saying that nothing is materializing, it is too slow, it is just a cosmetic thing, I think these kind of words, and I would say criticism, is very unfair and not constructive.
Q: Do you have any intention to reconcile with the United States and United Kingdom, especially the United States?
A: Since day one, we have no problem with the United States. We also don`t have any problem with the United Kingdom. The problem is, we did not create this unnecessary misunderstandings and I would say, problems. It was done from the other side. We did not interfere in their domestic issues or in their internal affairs. We are just trying to resolve our own domestic issue. People from outside are telling us what to do, how to do, when to do and who it has to choose, and all these things. As a sovereign independent country we do not like to be pushed around. At this stage, this government is taking the full responsibility of making sure that Myanmar can maintain this hard won peace, stability and national unity in the country. Because if we don`t have these basic requirements we can never become a democracy.
We have to build on it. We cannot jump steps and go for the overnight changes to become a democracy. It never works anywhere. We have to go step by step. We have to build good foundations and up. .up. . .up... so that finally we will become a very strong functioning democracy.
There is no other shortcut. We don`t see any other shortcut. Many other countries, many new democracies, failed when they tried to change overnight. They ended up having civil wars, lots of problems, chaos, and anarchism. We do not want to follow that path. We believe we are on the right track.
Thank you very much.